TPD ... consequences

[frenchnes]

Hi,
i am new to this forum, i have been vaping for 2 years, i am now on 0mg and love it. Because i am thinking of launching an e-liquid brand, i have been spending quite some time recently to read on TPD and try to understand the consequences.
One thing (a detail that most of you won't care about i guess ! ) i am struggling to understand is whether glass bottles will still be possible.
Let me explain : max volume bottles (for liquids with nicotine) will be 10ml. The other constraint is that containers must have a mechanism to ensure leak free refilling. Does that mean bottles with "pipettes" won't be allowed (as obiously you have to remove the lid and liquid could be spilt ? And having a "closed" glass bottle, without being able to squeeze, it wouldn't be convenient !
so do you think all bottles will be the classic 10ml plastic bottles ?
Thanks a lot for your answers !

 

[junglist]

Hi @frenchnes - cheers for signing up, good to have you here!

Yes, you are right, the glass dripper bottles won't be TPD compliant, they will have to be the 10ml PET bottles as far as I can see. They can only produce a certain number of drops per minute when held upside down as well so not any old 10 ml bottle will do...

If you do 0mg though you will not be caught by these restraints.

 

[frenchnes]

That's a pity ! also the entry barriers are much higher with all costs coming from toxicology and emission tests.. All in all my timing is probably not the best but i still have a view this is a great market with still a lot of room for good ideas !
What is your view on evolution of 0mg market ? To me it's quite specific in the sense that this is a product for non-smokers or for smokers that are done with nicotine hence could think of totally quitting as a next step or happy to vape with no nicotine addiction... and because it's different i guess the future of nicotine-free vaping and nicotine vaping could take different paths ?

 

[Lord Grim]

Hi @frenchnes .
Is it me being dim or is there an obvious but admittedly tenuous loophole here?
Some nic vendors (last time I saw) were planning on continuing nic sales post TPD, while others seem to be winding down.
So, assuming that the first group are correct, what's to stop clever vendors from selling (just to make the sums easy): 90ml of 0% in a 100 ml bottle and 10ml of nic in a separate bottle?

This seems far to easy to me for it to be viable, but at the same time I haven't seen it mentioned in any TPD threads that I've read, so how about it?

 

[MrTeaTime]

Hi @frenchnes .
Is it me being dim or is there an obvious but admittedly tenuous loophole here?
Some nic vendors (last time I saw) were planning on continuing nic sales post TPD, while others seem to be winding down.
So, assuming that the first group are correct, what's to stop clever vendors from selling (just to make the sums easy): 90ml of 0% in a 100 ml bottle and 10ml of nic in a separate bottle?

This seems far to easy to me for it to be viable, but at the same time I haven't seen it mentioned in any TPD threads that I've read, so how about it?

That's the route I would take.....nic shots are the future for me

 

[jaimunki]

If it's blatantly obvious, don't mention it

Lots of loopholes to be exploited.

Keeping quiet buys the vendors some more time, until their closed...

 

[Lord Grim]

Oops

 

[crustyfolker]

Nic shots: i recently saw a poat where a vendor was saying they would be offerring 10 ml nic shots for £1.25- 1.50 each. sound s good?
No its just a way to rip everyone off.
Factor this. 10 ml of 18mg nic base at £1.25 means its only a quarter the strength of 72 mg nic so £1.25 time 4 is a fiver, for 10 ml makes 100ml £50 makes a litre of 72mg £500. That is one hell of a mark up if you consider that at the moment you can get a litre of Nic for £39.99 ay darkstar plus postage of course. also the vendors will buy bulk nicotine which will work out way way less than £39.99 a litre.
Yes it has to be broke down diluted and bottles but come on who agrees that a mark up of 1200% is fair. Most business's buy wholesale and treble the cost to cover overheads and make a profit. seems like vapers get the thick end of the stick everytime with mark ups of 1000 plus%. make a profit yes exploit people well thats utter bollocks

 

[ZT]

Hi @frenchnes - cheers for signing up, good to have you here!

Yes, you are right, the glass dripper bottles won't be TPD compliant, they will have to be the 10ml PET bottles as far as I can see. They can only produce a certain number of drops per minute when held upside down as well so not any old 10 ml bottle will do...

If you do 0mg though you will not be caught by these restraints.

Nearly this

the bottles have to themselves be TPD compliant (they need to comply with various standards of composition, quality etc) although they CAN be LDPE or PET providing they meet with the criteria

Nibs have to be no shorter than 9mm (was 10mm but there were too many complaints from bottling companies about having to re-tool)

and release no more than 20 drops a minute when held upside down without squeezing

from memory!

you can put 0mg in whatever you want .. but from long and bitter experience I would advise against glass - as the number of people that prefer it over plastic is minimal - although the few that do tend to be very loud about it.

also a pipette is one of the worst ways of trying to fill most atomisers known too man. - especially the upcoming TPD compliant 2mm atomisers

 

[ZT]

Hi @frenchnes .
Is it me being dim or is there an obvious but admittedly tenuous loophole here?
Some nic vendors (last time I saw) were planning on continuing nic sales post TPD, while others seem to be winding down.
So, assuming that the first group are correct, what's to stop clever vendors from selling (just to make the sums easy): 90ml of 0% in a 100 ml bottle and 10ml of nic in a separate bottle?

This seems far to easy to me for it to be viable, but at the same time I haven't seen it mentioned in any TPD threads that I've read, so how about it?

Nic shots are a well known and lauded method past TPD - and a great idea


for as long as they are allowed

which I suspect will probably not be long.

well to be exact .. the nic shots will be fine .. the 0mg concentrate will be clamped down on eventually i suspect.