Plus ohm RDA, single coil builds.

[Cliffyboy1962]

It's a simple question that doesn't have a simple answer.

The answer is 'mechs' because they are regulated by resistance.

It's because people started drilling holes in tanks to have more airflow, are more air needs more vapour to 'balance' the vape.

It's because people wanted bigger clouds and needed more airflow.

It's what @oldhippydude said (and he's probably as cynical as me) ... how can a company sell you a 200w device when you only need 10w?

It's all these things and more.

There's no doubt that thin high resistance coils work, I'm always blown away by the performance of my naturevape coils, which are tiny micro coils made of thin wire 1.8ohms and at 7 or 8 watts produce better flavour and vapour than a 0.7 ohm nautilus coil.

People like to make massive generalisations about coil resistance but on regulated devices it doesn't make as much difference as you'd think. A 1.8ohm nautilus coil really isn't that different to a 0.7 ohm nautilus coil to vape on even though it's a huge difference in resistance. Why? because it's fitted in the same tank with the same airflow, same sized chimney and fitted in the same coil head and you just adjust the power so it vapes how you like it.

Those 0.2 smok coils that run at 150w? (or whatever) ... there's no doubt in my mind that you could make the same thing with a higher resistance that would need less power and vape just as well if not better. But for that company in particular that whole high power thing is a selling point now.

..... also there's almost no difference between a 0.9ohm coil and a 1.1ohm coil on a regulated device, but one is 'sub-ohm' (and all the connotations that come with that) and one isn't (and comes with another load of connotations) but in reality you'd be hard pushed to tell any difference on a regulated mod with the power adjusted accordingly.

...or maybe I'm just talking a load of nonsense as people seem to have different experiences with different gear, we do all vape differently..

So in essence really then, It was the quest for more vapour, that drove the sub-ohm revolution. Which obviously suggests that not everyone was happy with the amount of vapour the plus ohm stuff was creating.

This is pretty much in line with how I imagined it, but lots of people including yourself and @oldhippydude tend to suggest that all that power is unnecessary in order to chuck the vapour, to coin an expression you probably hate. Can an old plus ohm setup, using low power and high resistance coils create the same amount of vapour density per litre per second as a modern sub-ohm setup or not? That is my question.

Forgetting for the moment, of course, whether such amounts of vapour are actually desireable or not.

 

[Simon G]

So in essence really then, It was the quest for more vapour, that drove the sub-ohm revolution. Which obviously suggests that not everyone was happy with the amount of vapour the plus ohm stuff was creating.

This is pretty much in line with how I imagined it, but lots of people including yourself and @oldhippydude tend to suggest that all that power is unnecessary in order to chuck the vapour, to coin an expression you probably hate. Can an old plus ohm setup, using low power and high resistance coils create the same amount of vapour density per litre per second as a modern sub-ohm setup or not? That is my question.

Forgetting for the moment, of course, whether such amounts of vapour are actually desireable or not.

I would say it was the quest for more vapour on a mech mod, that drove it.....

and I wouldn't compare old set ups with modern set ups...... but if you are asking could a manufacturer create a 1.2 overall resistance multi head stock coil (similar to the beast coils that Smok make) that could chuck massive clouds like a 0.2ohm smok coil at a much lower power setting, then yes I totally believe that.... with a large amount of wicking around the coils and the right amount of airflow... yes absolutely.

 

[tasteslikefire]

It depends how much room you've got for the build. 10 wraps of 28 AWG stainless with a 3mm ID comes in a shade over 1 ohm. It's a tasty vape and doesn't take a huge amount to drive it.

 

[oldhippydude]

So in essence really then, It was the quest for more vapour, that drove the sub-ohm revolution. Which obviously suggests that not everyone was happy with the amount of vapour the plus ohm stuff was creating.

This is pretty much in line with how I imagined it, but lots of people including yourself and @oldhippydude tend to suggest that all that power is unnecessary in order to chuck the vapour, to coin an expression you probably hate. Can an old plus ohm setup, using low power and high resistance coils create the same amount of vapour density per litre per second as a modern sub-ohm setup or not? That is my question.

Forgetting for the moment, of course, whether such amounts of vapour are actually desireable or not.

If all you care about is huge clouds then you want huge coils, huge air and throw lots of power at it.
Not very subtle but it works.

Chasing clouds used to be a minority interest. It appealed to geeky types that wanted to push the limits of what could be done and required knowledge and experimentation.
Most people, then as now after a bit of experimentation found that 20w to 40w was more than enough and as I remember it when the first 100w boxes appeared most folk wandered what you could possibly need that for. then the subtanks started appearing and being sold to new vapers.

Because the power was there folk started asking in places like this about how they could use more power (how we laughed at the watt wanters) then smok came along to cater to them and their kit started to become starter kits and clouds became fashionable among some.

In my opinion the move to high power vaping was pushed by the industry rather than being demand led.

Whatever floats your boat is fine by me but the original poster wants to use his juice and batteries more efficiently and you have yet to give him any useful advice. You should probably start a new thread to discus the merits of high power v low power vaping.

 

[Cliffyboy1962]

Apologies. You are quite right. I should stop going off at a tangent like that. Now what was it the OP asked...............Doh, I forgot.

 

[Cliffyboy1962]

I suppose my advice, If I was ever in a position to be able to offer advice about coil building, would be ...............do like @tasteslikefire said. That sounds good and I think I am going to try it out as well for the sake of science.

 

[Cliffyboy1962]

Firstly, apologies if this isn't exactly advice (well it's definitely not)

I built a 26 awg 8 wrap coil 2.5mm i.d. that came out and just under an ohm. It is a tiny little coil. I installed it in my Oumier Wasp nano. I vaped it at 19w which drew 4.5A at 4.37v. I set the airflow at about 1/2 open.

I was pleasantly surprised. It needed a relatively long draw (which I do not mind) and it produced a calm peaceful vape. If suddenly all my gear was taken from and that was all that was left I would survive. The vapour production was (struggling to find the right word) O.K. Flavour was good, not exceptional not up there with other tanks I have but passable.

I then switched over to my Ijoy captain tank, airflow wide open, with it's CA8 coil reading 0.13 ohms running at 77.7W and it blows my little Nano away. Huge dense vapour with intense flavour. It's a different ball game of a vape.

What I would say is, using four times as much power and probably four times as much juice, it's probably not producing four times as much vapour. Maybe twice as much and a bit.

So in summary, It feels like a case of once you sub-ohm, plus-ohming seems a little underwhelming. It would be far better to have never gone there and then a smaller vape wouldn't seem so small.

Hope my experience will somehow help the OP with his choice.

Edit:

Having vaped it for a little bit longer, and dripped it with a slightly stronger RY4D based juice (about 4-5mg) I really am enjoying it Ii's really rather good and my dual 18650 mod should go for about a week without charging.

 

[Simon G]

Firstly, apologies if this isn't exactly advice (well it's definitely not)

I built a 26 awg 8 wrap coil 2.5mm i.d. that came out and just under an ohm. It is a tiny little coil. I installed it in my Oumier Wasp nano. I vaped it at 19w which drew 4.5A at 4.37v. I set the airflow at about 1/2 open.

I was pleasantly surprised. It needed a relatively long draw (which I do not mind) and it produced a calm peaceful vape. If suddenly all my gear was taken from and that was all that was left I would survive. The vapour production was (struggling to find the right word) O.K. Flavour was good, not exceptional not up there with other tanks I have but passable.

I then switched over to my Ijoy captain tank, airflow wide open, with it's CA8 coil reading 0.13 ohms running at 77.7W and it blows my little Nano away. Huge dense vapour with intense flavour. It's a different ball game of a vape.

What I would say is, using four times as much power and probably four times as much juice, it's probably not producing four times as much vapour. Maybe twice as much and a bit.

So in summary, It feels like a case of once you sub-ohm, plus-ohming seems a little underwhelming. It would be far better to have never gone there and then a smaller vape wouldn't seem so small.

Hope my experience will somehow help the OP with his choice.

You compared a single coil in a tiny RDA with half open airflow ... to an 'Octuple Coil Head' in a wide open tank.

That's your 'sub-ohmr' test?

 

[Cliffyboy1962]

You compared a single coil in a tiny RDA with half open airflow ... to an 'Octuple Coil Head' in a wide open tank.

That's your 'sub-ohmr' test?

Good job I didn't pick up my TFV12 running at 133W !

 

[Biig Jonnie]

I don't think the muted flavour is because you have a sub-ohm coil and I don't think putting one in above 1 ohm is going to transform the flavour either, that makes no sense at all to me.

.... I don't really know what to suggest as a 0.8ohm coil is exactly what I would recommend and what I would use in a single coil RDA. I think you'd get more variation in your vape by adjusting the wattage and airflow.

I've said I want a high resistance coil so that I can vape at lower watts and use less battery and less eliquid, I've said that the flavour I'm getting is less than the same juice in a tank lol you've just read it wrong. The other guy is right I've watched a few videos and the wicking has a huge impact on flavour so that's what I need to work on, I've done another build today with less cotton, still only one coil nearly at 1ohm and plenty of cotton and juice wicking from the empty juice well. I can take these kind of builds out with me and vape at 25-30 watts max and the battery will last a day and a half, the flavours much better and you still get almost as much vapour production as two low ohm coils.

Really low sub ohm duel coil builds came in for cloud chasing on mech mods and that's all there good for.