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A guide on calculating amp load using a regulated mod.

Sorry, another question @conanthewarrior ...
2x30Qs (19A CDR claimed) in my SkyStar and I want to vape at 50W, so using your formula with values of 3.1V cutoff and .85 efficiency, I got the answer 9.4A, which should be a doddle for the cells, but the mod's display reads over 19A, which exceeds the CDR. Is my mod reporting the Amps draw on the cells or the output of the board? Pardon my ignorance but if it's the latter I'm not really sure what the point of that is. /shrugs

Its whats going to the atomiser, at 50W the board showing 19A I guess your build is low resistance yes?

It's not the battery side, I think the screen Amps shown can cause a lot of confusion. It is indeed what you calculated being drawn from your cells-under 10A.
 
<SNIPped but read>...

...This works out as P(watts)/V(cut off voltage)=I(amps)

The full calculation is Watts used/Minimum single battery voltage/number of batteries/Mod Efficiency.

I've found this extremely useful, many thanks.
Taking the figures you gave elsewhere in the post: 3.1 Volt and 85% efficient as averages, I've been able to look at some batteries I bought without really knowing what they were capable of and re-jigging the algebra to come up with a rule-of-thumb for batteries you've already got. The magic number is 2.635, obtained from cutoff x efficiency, and from that I get the following...

2.635 multiplied by the number of cells multiplied by the CDR is the max Watts you can ask for from those cells in that device.

This is great because I bought some high capacity batteries before I knew anything about Amps vs mAh, I just saw the big number and went Ooooh 3,500 must be better than 2,000 but then a friend said be careful because... well you know why. I didn't at the time.

10Amps CDR = 26W per cell. 15A = 39W and so on... easy peasy. Thanks again. :D
 
Hi fellow apes, recently I have noticed a lot of people, mainly new vapers, asking if their build is safe on their regulated mod, and some confusion amongst the answers.

Skip to the end for a simple explanation of maximum wattage to use as a rough guide if you just want to know if you are in a safe zone or not.

I thought I would write a little guide to try and help here, and let everyone that uses a regulated mod know if they are within safe limits, or actually think they are safe, but in fact maybe not.

The main issue is a lot of people still calculate as if they are using a mech, using standard Ohms law calculations at full charge voltage. With a regulated mod, what hits your atomiser follows the standard Ohms law calculations, this is the output of the board.
This is not helped by the fact mods display the output amp load and voltage, leading to more confusion as people think as their mod shows the amp load, it must be what is being drawn from their batteries. It isn't. It is the output of the board.
What you really want to know though, for battery safety, is what is happening at the INPUT of the board.

This works out as P(watts)/V(cut off voltage)=I(amps)

The full calculation is Watts used/Minimum single battery voltage/number of batteries/Mod Efficiency.

I will use a few examples here, to show you the difference between a single, dual and triple 18650 device, and the amp load that is being asked from your batteries at a given wattage.
I will use 75W in all examples, as this seems to be an average maximum for a single 18650 mod, and also will show how as input voltage increases with more cells, amp load decreases- which is how mods with more batteries in series can offer higher power levels safely.

Lets use a single battery mod first, at 75W.

The calculation here, assuming a 3.1V cut off, and also an efficiency of 85% (I am using this as it is the efficiency of the DNA75 and its efficiency is shown in the datasheet) is-

75/3.1=24.19 Divide the answer by 0.85 for 85% efficiency, and this leaves you at 28.46A- far over a 20A cells CDR. I did not have to include the number of batteries part of the calculation due to there being just one cell.

Now, for a dual 18650 device.

The calculation here is, assuming 90% efficiency this time-

75/3.1/2=12.09A. Divide your answer by 0.9 for the 90% efficiency and this leaves you at 13.44A. As you can see, you are now within a 20A batteries CDR, even at cut off where amp load is highest.

Now, the final one, a triple 18650 device. I will again use 90% efficiency.

75/3.1/3=8.06A. Divide by 0.9 for the efficiency, and you are left at 8.96A.

So, you can see in each instance the amp load decreases as the battery number increases- this is due to the higher input voltage. A regulated mod will draw less amps from its battery/batteries at full charge vs cut off voltage, which is why it is safest to use cut off voltage.

Now, you may be thinking what about resistance? This is where the mistake usually happens- with a regulated mod, this effects output voltage and amp level, but NOT the input amp load!
To hit high power levels,you may need to build within a certain resistance band so you don't hit output voltage and amp limits, but it is how a mod like the DNA200 has a fuse that blows on the input side at 25A, but can output 50A constant/55A burst and 200W of power!

Here is the page on steam engine that can be used to work out what is bring drawn from your batteries- as you can see, what is pulled from your batteries is very different to what hits your atomizer http://www.steam-engine.org/batt.asp , this is handy to double check your calculations or even to use quickly to check you are safe.

TL,DR- Just divide your watts used, by the input voltage, followed by mod efficiency to give you a correct figure regarding amp load on your batteries. A regulated mod CAN push more watts safely while the battery puts out more volts- near full charge in easy terms.

Safe wattages for each mod with a 20A CDR (Constant/Continuos Discharge rating- how many amps your battery can put out safely, and continuously till the end of its charge. This is the rating you want to know, ignore pulse ratings as these are pushing past a batteries design, although as you learn more you may feel comfortable doing so).
This is highly dependant on your mods cut off, and is a rough guide!

Using 90% efficiency at 3.1V cut off per cell-

Single 18650- 55 Watts. At cutoff, this would give you 19.71A, very close to a 20A CDR battery.

Dual 18650- 110W. At a cutoff of 6.2V, or 3.1V per cell, this again leaves you at 19.71A.

Triple 18650- 162W.
This is assuming a cut off of 9V, which is the lowest I personally know of triple 18650 mods cutting off, so 3V per cell.
This will be drawing 20A, dead on a 20A CDR.
These are all at CUT OFF, higher wattage can be achieved at full charge of your batteries, this is the MAXIMUM amp load possible.

If you are using batteries such as LG HD4's or Sony VTC5A's, with a 25A CDR, or even 30A cells such as LG HB6's, you will be able to achieve higher wattages safely using the calculations I provided.
there is no need for learning this regulated mods store power on the board u are not drawing straight from the battery
 
there is no need for learning this regulated mods store power on the board u are not drawing straight from the battery
No, the battery feeds the input of the board, and what come out is what hits your atomiser. However, if you want to know what is actually being drawn from your batteries, its worth knowing. A mech user would want to know they are within safe limits, so why not regulated?
 
No, the battery feeds the input of the board, and what come out is what hits your atomiser. However, if you want to know what is actually being drawn from your batteries, its worth knowing. A mech user would want to know they are within safe limits, so why not regulated?


With a regulated mod basically the chip in your variable v/w mod takes in power from the battery and stores it in a capacitor. When the stored energy reaches the potential (voltage) it dumps out to the atty.
 
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this is why ur mod flags low battery when u up the wattage and the bats are not empty it's to much for the cap

edit inductor not capacitor

back to mi first post
ignore this thread and use what u want
 
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The 4.2 voltage limitation only applies when talking about using the battery in a mechanical mod.
With a regulated mod basically the chip in your variable v/w mod takes in power from the battery and stores it in a capacitor. When the stored energy reaches the potential (voltage) it dumps out to the atty.

I'm not mentioning the 4.2V calculations used in a mechanical mod- I'm talking about when amp load is at its highest regulated, which is at cutoff voltage, usually around 3.1V per cell depending on mod- amp load increases as voltage decreases regulated.

Take for example a DNA75. It's cutoff can be set as low as 2.75V in Escribe- that would be drawing a pretty large 28.7A from a single cell at full power and cutoff, so I think its fairly important to know.

This is information I have learnt over a long period of time, with well known members of the community giving similar explanations that all calculate the same.

We ALL need to stay safe, so knowing how many amps are being drawn from your batteries is important if you are pushing things- even regulated.
 
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I'm not mentioning the 4.2V calculations used in a mechanical mod- I'm talking about when amp load is at its highest regulated, which is at cutoff voltage, usually around 3.1V per cell depending on mod- amp load increases as voltage decreases regulated.

Take for example a DNA75. It's cutoff can be set as low as 2.75V in Escribe- that would be drawing a pretty large 28.7A from a single cell at full power and cutoff, so I think its fairly important to know.

This is information I have learnt over a long period of time, with well known members of the community giving similar explanations that all calculate the same.

We ALL need to stay safe, so knowing how many amps are being drawn from your batteries is important if you are pushing things- even regulated.
i hear u but it doesnt work like a mech mate power is stored on the board minamising overloading the batteries

removeable external batteries which are safe chemistry (IMR/INR). The protection circuitry of the processor prevents any problems regardless of what battery u use within reason of course

iv never heard of a regs battery going unless it was caused by usb charging !
 
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batteries' maximum discharge rate. I'm speaking of the removeable external batteries which are safe chemistry (IMR/INR). The protection circuitry of the processor prevents

These are well recognised calculations for working out how many amps you are pulling from a regulated mod- the reason it is here is so many people used to say "Go use Ohms law" when someone asked what is being drawn from their battery/batteries.

That doesn't matter with a regulated mod, so you can build wherever you want which I think is what you might mean. You can still go past a cells 'safe' range with a regulated mod though- what hits your atty is not the same as what is drawn from your batteries, which I can tell you know.

It IS the way to work it out though- you can check steam engine, then my calculations, just make sure you choose regulated (APV) and set the input voltage when you do.
 
These are well recognised calculations for working out how many amps you are pulling from a regulated mod- the reason it is here is so many people used to say "Go use Ohms law" when someone asked what is being drawn from their battery/batteries.

That doesn't matter with a regulated mod, so you can build wherever you want which I think is what you might mean. You can still go past a cells 'safe' range with a regulated mod though- what hits your atty is not the same as what is drawn from your batteries, which I can tell you know.

It IS the way to work it out though- you can check steam engine, then my calculations, just make sure you choose regulated (APV) and set the input voltage when you do.
does it take into account for the power stored on board or is the calculations made using the same rules as a mech ?
Thus nullifying the said calculations in the first place
 
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